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[Music]

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listening to the introduction Breslow

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find us at hidden truths show.com follow

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please subscribe rate and review us

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under podcast app here's Fresno welcome

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back to the hidden truth show what

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happened in Palm Beach our deep dive

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into the obscene scandal

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our guest today may be the most

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knowledgeable person on the epstein

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scandal other than those actually

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involved in the crimes

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Conchita Sarnoff is executive director

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of the Alliance to rescue victims of

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trafficking

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it's a Washington DC organization whose

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mission is to raise awareness of human

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trafficking and end child sex

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trafficking she's also a senior fellow

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at Georgetown University School foreign

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foreign service human trafficking

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Research Center she was the first to

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expose the absurdly mild sentence that

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Epstein received in Florida in a Daily

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Beast article in 2010 she went on to

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become the foremost expert on Jeffrey

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Epstein and his sex trafficking ring she

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authored the book traffic King in 2016

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in which she yanked back the curtain on

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Epstein's underworld where children pay

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the ultimate price as victims the story

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explores the darkest recesses of the

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corridors of power from Harvard to the

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White House the book exposed Epstein in

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the longest-running human trafficking

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case in US legal history a scandal she

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says is more significant than the

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Lewinsky and Watergate scandals combined

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before we get to our interview if you've

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not already please subscribe to and rate

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our show on your podcast app and for

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video of this interview go to our

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youtube channel the hidden truth show

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now our interview with Conchita Sarnoff

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the most obvious question just to start

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with is you know everybody out there

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wants to know you know did he kill

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himself or did he not so let's just

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start with your opinion as to what you

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really think happened in prison well Jim

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thank you for having me on your show let

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me just start with

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the fact that I received a phone call

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from an active federal agent

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a few days after Epstein's arrest and

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the agent said to me two things he will

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not make it to trial

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there are towels on the inside I became

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so concerned about these two statements

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that I immediately contacted the

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Washington Post I also contacted the

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attorney general's office

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I spoke to Cory Amundson who is the head

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of the OPR Office of Professional

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Responsibility and I sent a letter to

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Martin Weinberg one of Epstein's lead

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attorneys and I copied Alan Dershowitz

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and I basically told these gentlemen

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that I had received this phone call that

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I had been perhaps forewarned and that I

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would hope that they would secure him

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and make sure that in spite of my

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feelings about Epstein and what he's

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done which clearly is was criminal he

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needed to be alive to go to that trial

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and face his victims so I gave this

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information to these people and within

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literally days there was the first

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alleged suicide attempt not 45 days

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later Epstein was found dead so in my

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opinion I do not believe that Epstein

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committed suicide the this who was it

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that alerted you somebody from I'm sorry

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I cannot reveal my source but I will

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tell you the person is an active federal

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agent and did you believe he was

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alerting you that he thought that

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Epstein was likely to commit suicide or

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was likely to be killed no no I believe

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he was alerting me that Epstein would be

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killed so the question then is a

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if you don't believe you commit a

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suicide how did this occur because he is

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alone in a locked cell there are cameras

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although there was nothing on the cell

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at the time apparently but there are

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cameras throughout the prison you know

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I've been asking people who believe that

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he did not commit suicide okay well then

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walk me through a scenario as to how

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this could have happened who killed him

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and how could they have possibly done it

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well I certainly don't have the answer

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as to who killed him and I don't even

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wish to speculate because it's much too

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dark for me to do so and perhaps even

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dangerous that's number one number two

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it is very unusual that two of the

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guards who were supposed to guard him

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both fell asleep it is also highly

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unusual that a man who had been placed

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on suicide watch had been within six

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days removed from suicide watch it is

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also most unusual that his cell mate the

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former policeman Nicolas I can't

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remember his last name family name was

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also removed from his cell gym the night

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prior to his alleged suicide all these

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circumstances are just too bizarre and

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the fact that I received a phone call

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from from a federal agent to tell me

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that he wouldn't make it to trial that

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there were towels on the inside just to

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me really gave me a whole different

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meaning of why and what and how how deep

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and how complex this case has been over

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the past ten years I mean I have been

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investigating the cases you know since

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2009 and I broke the case wide open in

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2010 and then I after many struggles I

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published the book in 2016 and I can

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tell

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you uh there has been so much pushback

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on the Epstein case and as someone who

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has had no institutional protection

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whatsoever because I'm not a journalist

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per se I do not work for any publication

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nor have I ever worked for a publication

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I've only contributed to different

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publications it has been an uphill

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battle to even publish what I have

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published so far and you also state that

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you are offered bribes I was at one

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point at the very beginning when I

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started to write the book I was offered

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a bribe by someone who knows who knew

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Epstein who was very close to Epstein

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and knows me as well and so when we had

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breakfast this person asked me to have

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breakfast with him in Florida I was in

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Miami investigating the Epstein case and

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I and I agreed not knowing what the

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question was you know the reason for the

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breakfast and he proceeded to tell me

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you know what would it be what would you

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reconsider stopping to write the book if

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you were if you were given five million

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dollars at which point I really just

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laughed because I thought it was just

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the whole thing was so ludicrous so you

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he was essentially a friend or

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representative of Epstein I don't know

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he could have been representing Epstein

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he could have been representing the

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Clintons he could have been representing

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any of those people who I've identified

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in my book but I'm assuming and and this

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is just an assumption of course that he

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was either representing Epstein of

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Minton's what one of the two because

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neither of the two wanted this story

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published well I certainly sorry

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finished no and in fact when I brought

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the case I attempted to bring the case

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to the attempt attention of the Obama

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administration which I thought would be

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very proactive because I always knew

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from the former Labor Secretary of Costa

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that this case the Epstein case could be

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refiled in a

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State because not only had a Kosta told

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me in a letter back in 2011 which I

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published in The Daily Beast Acosta had

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told me over repeatedly that a new

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jurisdiction could always indict him and

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sure enough the 2019 arrest in tooth in

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July six was exactly that if you look at

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the charges against Epstein when they

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arrested him Saturday July 6 they were

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to two old 2005 charges so Acosta was

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right any state be it New York New

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Mexico California or the United States

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Virgin Islands because they were new

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jurisdictions could have arrested

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Epstein at any point between 2010 and

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2009 teen so why did it they wait 10

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years why did in New York wait 10 years

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to arrest Epstein that is what we need

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to find out well I'm gonna assume you're

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gonna say the Clinton connection because

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if you've got Obama in office with

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Hillary as the Secretary of State and

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the likely next Democratic president

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they're going to not prosecute and

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protect now you've got an entirely new

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administration with no particular love

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for the Clintons and in fact quite the

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opposite is that your theory as to why

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things changed

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I believe so yes I do believe that so

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we're talking about whether he's the

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head of the snake or not is is there

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someone above him in this operation as

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far as you know okay well in terms of

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the SEC's operation which is what I'm

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assuming you're talking about the sex

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ring corrals think that he had his own

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sex ring so he is the head of that snake

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however he wasn't alone and I'm not so

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sure that he was the head of it and I'll

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tell you I'll explain it why because you

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know he wasn't it wasn't just for him he

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was bringing in a lot of very powerful

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people so even though he was consuming

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and obviously he was he was a predator I

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think there were other predators perhaps

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more powerful than him

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perhaps richer than him who were also

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part of this but you know I have my

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doubt Jim as to whether I I don't

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believe that Epstein created the sex

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ring in order to extort other men I

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don't believe that's what he did I

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believe he was simply a degenerate and a

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pedophile and he found himself mixed up

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with a group of very powerful men who

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were equally as degenerate and equally

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as powerful and they all participated in

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the same activity and certainly could be

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other sources of children that some of

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these people are tapping into such as

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such as the Prince the Prince Andrew yes

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and n MC squared remember MC squared was

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a source a very important source for

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epstein and it was a legitimate vehicle

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in which Epstein was able to bring and

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transport and hire these girls under the

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guise of modeling in fact one of the

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procures Nadia marcin Cova was brought

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in through MC squared and she's now a

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pilot in South Florida she was his

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girlfriend if you want to call her that

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and she also had relations with Epstein

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and Glenn Maxwell and certain several

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victims claimed that Nadia participated

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in their sexual activities as well and

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she lived with Epstein unlike most of

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the girls

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Nadia Marcin koba lived with Epstein so

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again you don't believe there was any

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blackmail involved because one of the

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things swirling around is a Mossad right

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do I believe there's blackmail oh sorry

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there's this thing that's so I believe I

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believe that Epstein had a lot of

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information on a lot of people sir

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we had enough information on a hood

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Barack the former Prime Minister that

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might have heard him I have no doubt

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about that but you know who better than

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the Mossad to have information on other

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people I mean I'm pretty sure that hood

276
00:13:46,260 --> 00:13:42,250
Barack had equally as much if not more

277
00:13:49,590 --> 00:13:46,270
information on every Rock so they

278
00:13:56,150 --> 00:13:49,600
theoretically were aware of Epstein and

279
00:13:59,280 --> 00:13:56,160
could have paid him to help get dirt on

280
00:14:01,230 --> 00:13:59,290
certain people I'm sorry could you

281
00:14:03,060 --> 00:14:01,240
repeat that I didn't I'm sorry I lost

282
00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:03,070
the connection could you repeat that way

283
00:14:08,310 --> 00:14:05,290
I guess the question is what was Mossad

284
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:08,320
likely aware at minimum aware of Epstein

285
00:14:14,550 --> 00:14:12,250
aware of what he was doing he does

286
00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:14,560
business with the prime minister of

287
00:14:19,050 --> 00:14:16,330
course they're aware they're more than

288
00:14:23,190 --> 00:14:19,060
aware and remember Epstein was a Jewish

289
00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:23,200
faith I mean he wasn't he was a donor he

290
00:14:28,140 --> 00:14:25,690
he obviously was very friendly with Alan

291
00:14:31,230 --> 00:14:28,150
Dershowitz Alan Dershowitz was his

292
00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:31,240
attorney and Alan Dershowitz I'm sure is

293
00:14:37,230 --> 00:14:34,690
very well known by the Mossad and and he

294
00:14:40,380 --> 00:14:37,240
surrounded himself with people and gangs

295
00:14:43,740 --> 00:14:40,390
when her mother was also someone who was

296
00:14:46,380 --> 00:14:43,750
very identified with the Mossad as was

297
00:14:48,570 --> 00:14:46,390
Gillen Maxwell so Epstein surrounded

298
00:14:52,140 --> 00:14:48,580
himself with individuals and friends and

299
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:52,150
associates who who were well known to

300
00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:54,490
the Mossad yes so the answer to your

301
00:14:57,870 --> 00:14:56,410
question is absolutely yes George

302
00:15:01,640 --> 00:14:57,880
Mitchell seemed to be kind of a

303
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:01,650
surprising name to come up in all this

304
00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:04,050
how do you think he was involved in this

305
00:15:09,750 --> 00:15:07,500
well from what I've read because I never

306
00:15:12,270 --> 00:15:09,760
interviewed George Mitchell I have not

307
00:15:16,230 --> 00:15:12,280
yet interviewed him let me just say that

308
00:15:20,010 --> 00:15:16,240
so from what I've read you know he was

309
00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:20,020
part of that circle and I accepted

310
00:15:24,770 --> 00:15:22,570
donations and I and and you know when

311
00:15:28,620 --> 00:15:24,780
you accept donations from the devil

312
00:15:32,070 --> 00:15:28,630
that's what to get what about Leslie

313
00:15:33,870 --> 00:15:32,080
Wexner role in the whole thing oh no no

314
00:15:35,670 --> 00:15:33,880
I think he plays a major role I mean I

315
00:15:37,769 --> 00:15:35,680
think first of all Leslie and

316
00:15:39,660 --> 00:15:37,779
epstein had an intimate relationship for

317
00:15:42,629 --> 00:15:39,670
many many years I believe that they were

318
00:15:46,739 --> 00:15:42,639
very close friends Wexner as everyone

319
00:15:48,540 --> 00:15:46,749
knows was the one who basically rescued

320
00:15:51,929 --> 00:15:48,550
Epstein when he was fired from Bear

321
00:15:54,090 --> 00:15:51,939
Stearns I told you earlier and Wexner

322
00:15:57,419 --> 00:15:54,100
was the one who provided Epstein with

323
00:16:00,509 --> 00:15:57,429
the first 1 billion dollars to set up

324
00:16:04,139 --> 00:16:00,519
his firm in New York and then who also

325
00:16:05,790 --> 00:16:04,149
gave him many many assets you know and

326
00:16:08,129 --> 00:16:05,800
transferred many of his assets to

327
00:16:10,559 --> 00:16:08,139
Epstein and Epstein was on Leslie's

328
00:16:14,850 --> 00:16:10,569
board on Leslie Wexner is board for

329
00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:14,860
years he actually was a was someone that

330
00:16:22,319 --> 00:16:17,050
was you know he created quite a stir

331
00:16:24,299 --> 00:16:22,329
within mr. Wexler's board because they

332
00:16:26,910 --> 00:16:24,309
didn't understand the relationship they

333
00:16:31,919 --> 00:16:26,920
didn't want him around in fact mrs.

334
00:16:34,919 --> 00:16:31,929
Wexner Bella Wexner was I read I never

335
00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:34,929
interviewed her but I read in several

336
00:16:42,119 --> 00:16:38,170
documents that she was quite upset at

337
00:16:45,299 --> 00:16:42,129
the relationship that her son Leslie had

338
00:16:52,169 --> 00:16:45,309
with Epstein and didn't quite understand

339
00:16:56,460 --> 00:16:52,179
why mr. Wexner gave so much access to to

340
00:17:00,329 --> 00:16:56,470
mr. Epstein was Wexner a pedophile or is

341
00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:00,339
he well I you know I have never had a

342
00:17:09,500 --> 00:17:03,610
victim come to me and say that mr.

343
00:17:13,199 --> 00:17:09,510
Wexner is a pedophile never I have had a

344
00:17:15,689 --> 00:17:13,209
source which I would prefer not to name

345
00:17:20,149 --> 00:17:15,699
right now even though he was interviewed

346
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:20,159
by the FBI back in 2010

347
00:17:27,090 --> 00:17:23,770
this source who knows mr. Wexner and

348
00:17:31,130 --> 00:17:27,100
knows and knew mr. Epstein said that

349
00:17:34,860 --> 00:17:31,140
when he was redecorating the USVI house

350
00:17:37,799 --> 00:17:34,870
that he was told by mr. Epstein to

351
00:17:40,919 --> 00:17:37,809
decorate one of the bedrooms in blue and

352
00:17:45,330 --> 00:17:40,929
one of the bedrooms in pink for children

353
00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:45,340
hmm make of that what you wish but that

354
00:17:51,609 --> 00:17:47,570
mr. Wexner was there

355
00:17:53,049 --> 00:17:51,619
this happened and you know I that

356
00:17:55,629 --> 00:17:53,059
doesn't mean anything that doesn't mean

357
00:17:57,070 --> 00:17:55,639
that mr. what's their new word certainly

358
00:17:59,349 --> 00:17:57,080
you think they were close enough though

359
00:18:06,039 --> 00:17:59,359
that Wexner was aware that he was

360
00:18:08,019 --> 00:18:06,049
running some type of a child if you give

361
00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:08,029
somebody a billion dollars and you give

362
00:18:12,669 --> 00:18:10,570
them about five properties worth

363
00:18:13,810 --> 00:18:12,679
millions of dollars don't you think

364
00:18:18,629 --> 00:18:13,820
you're gonna be close to that person

365
00:18:20,529 --> 00:18:18,639
yeah so he could be in trouble in is it

366
00:18:22,719 --> 00:18:20,539
Abercrombie and Fitch is one of his

367
00:18:24,820 --> 00:18:22,729
companies right yes

368
00:18:29,409 --> 00:18:24,830
they're the ones that were putting very

369
00:18:31,509 --> 00:18:29,419
young models in their catalogs well you

370
00:18:32,499 --> 00:18:31,519
don't have to go further you look at

371
00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:32,509
Victoria's Secret

372
00:18:37,269 --> 00:18:35,090
look at the whole concept of Victoria's

373
00:18:43,029 --> 00:18:37,279
Secret and the modeling the models the

374
00:18:44,919 --> 00:18:43,039
Angels yes okay what about the Anthony

375
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:44,929
Weiner connection he liked young young

376
00:18:51,999 --> 00:18:47,210
girls no but there was no connection

377
00:18:56,019 --> 00:18:52,009
between in fact I I found it shocking

378
00:18:59,440 --> 00:18:56,029
that mrs. Clinton hands over 30,000

379
00:19:02,049 --> 00:18:59,450
emails to uma Abidine who then somehow

380
00:19:04,570 --> 00:19:02,059
transfers it to Anthony Weiner given the

381
00:19:07,299 --> 00:19:04,580
investigation the sexting investigation

382
00:19:10,210 --> 00:19:07,309
that was going on and they appear on

383
00:19:13,419 --> 00:19:10,220
Anthony Weiner's laptop I mean that to

384
00:19:16,690 --> 00:19:13,429
me was shocking only because of a lack

385
00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:16,700
of security measures but you didn't find

386
00:19:22,570 --> 00:19:19,369
in that trove of emails anything related

387
00:19:24,460 --> 00:19:22,580
to Epstein and I'm pretty sure that well

388
00:19:27,940 --> 00:19:24,470
I know that mrs. Clinton Secretary

389
00:19:29,649 --> 00:19:27,950
Clinton back then was fully aware she

390
00:19:32,710 --> 00:19:29,659
knew Epstein had been indicted and

391
00:19:36,249 --> 00:19:32,720
arrested and sentenced and registered as

392
00:19:39,339 --> 00:19:36,259
a level 3 sex offender so I don't think

393
00:19:41,769 --> 00:19:39,349
that she would advise Huma Abedin to

394
00:19:43,869 --> 00:19:41,779
advise her husband to associate with

395
00:19:47,940 --> 00:19:43,879
Epstein so what is your understanding as

396
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:47,950
to where those 30,000 emails are today

397
00:19:53,219 --> 00:19:50,330
well nobody has investigated that I

398
00:19:58,239 --> 00:19:53,229
certainly haven't done that either so I

399
00:20:01,240 --> 00:19:58,249
cannot give you an educated an educated

400
00:20:03,580 --> 00:20:01,250
response to that if and when I

401
00:20:07,299 --> 00:20:03,590
I will let you know but that's not my

402
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:07,309
investigation today so you you stated

403
00:20:11,289 --> 00:20:08,570
that you think that he may have been

404
00:20:14,799 --> 00:20:11,299
killed it may not have been a suicide so

405
00:20:16,450 --> 00:20:14,809
who would have wanted him dead well as I

406
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:16,460
said before I

407
00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:21,770
there are several several individuals

408
00:20:26,470 --> 00:20:24,650
who might have wanted to him you know

409
00:20:29,830 --> 00:20:26,480
who might have wanted to help him

410
00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:29,840
disappear I mean look he was going to

411
00:20:36,899 --> 00:20:33,530
get if he went to trial chances are that

412
00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:36,909
he would have been found guilty and

413
00:20:48,310 --> 00:20:41,570
sentenced to perhaps 40 years chances

414
00:20:53,230 --> 00:20:48,320
are that Epstein knew too much about too

415
00:20:56,140 --> 00:20:53,240
many powerful people we know that as Ben

416
00:20:59,049 --> 00:20:56,150
Virginia said in a deposition we are in

417
00:21:01,120 --> 00:20:59,059
each other's pockets which means that I

418
00:21:04,690 --> 00:21:01,130
have secrets that you have and you have

419
00:21:07,870 --> 00:21:04,700
secrets that I have and so there was too

420
00:21:13,330 --> 00:21:07,880
much of that and it already was too far

421
00:21:15,909 --> 00:21:13,340
gone and too much media exposure and I

422
00:21:17,830 --> 00:21:15,919
think it was a number of people you know

423
00:21:20,500 --> 00:21:17,840
I think it was I think it was just too

424
00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:20,510
coincidental the two policemen went to

425
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:22,850
sleep and perhaps the investigation that

426
00:21:29,470 --> 00:21:25,970
should follow is the bank accounts of

427
00:21:31,419 --> 00:21:29,480
these policemen let's see how much money

428
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:31,429
appears in their account within the next

429
00:21:36,490 --> 00:21:33,890
year yeah I mean certainly very risky

430
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:36,500
maneuver to kill him in prison because

431
00:21:40,360 --> 00:21:38,330
there is gonna be an investigation to

432
00:21:41,890 --> 00:21:40,370
find out if that happens who did it so

433
00:21:42,810 --> 00:21:41,900
now you've got someone who's an

434
00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:42,820
accomplice to murder

435
00:21:47,380 --> 00:21:45,110
absolutely but you know the cameras all

436
00:21:50,529 --> 00:21:47,390
of a sudden were off there were no

437
00:21:53,110 --> 00:21:50,539
cameras yeah right so the cameras are

438
00:21:58,000 --> 00:21:53,120
turned off the two policemen go to sleep

439
00:21:59,799 --> 00:21:58,010
the thing is who suggested or who told

440
00:22:02,740 --> 00:21:59,809
the policeman to go to sleep both of

441
00:22:06,279 --> 00:22:02,750
them and perhaps the investigation

442
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:06,289
should be should follow that line mm-hmm

443
00:22:09,669 --> 00:22:07,730
I thought it was interesting that the

444
00:22:11,529 --> 00:22:09,679
allegations brought in the New York case

445
00:22:14,409 --> 00:22:11,539
were essentially the same allegations

446
00:22:17,229 --> 00:22:14,419
2005 to 2008 what is your

447
00:22:19,599 --> 00:22:17,239
leaf and understanding as to what he was

448
00:22:22,810 --> 00:22:19,609
up to once he got out of his one-year

449
00:22:24,669 --> 00:22:22,820
prison term in Florida did he go right

450
00:22:26,109 --> 00:22:24,679
back to all the same activities and if

451
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:26,119
so how come how come there was no

452
00:22:33,519 --> 00:22:28,970
charges for that absolutely well that's

453
00:22:36,700 --> 00:22:33,529
that's the big question you know I read

454
00:22:42,399 --> 00:22:36,710
about it I was silenced for a long time

455
00:22:45,999 --> 00:22:42,409
Jim I knocked on many doors asking for

456
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:46,009
an investigation in New York I asked for

457
00:22:51,820 --> 00:22:49,850
an investigation in California nobody

458
00:22:56,549 --> 00:22:51,830
paid attention to me over the years I

459
00:22:59,979 --> 00:22:56,559
wrote in several and several news papers

460
00:23:02,680 --> 00:22:59,989
op-eds concerning Epstein and the

461
00:23:05,229 --> 00:23:02,690
ongoing onslaught of victims

462
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:05,239
the New York Post took photographs the

463
00:23:09,070 --> 00:23:06,970
New York Daily News took photographs

464
00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:09,080
constantly of him in and out of his

465
00:23:14,249 --> 00:23:11,690
house so the question is why did the

466
00:23:19,149 --> 00:23:14,259
Manhattan district attorney prior to

467
00:23:21,759 --> 00:23:19,159
2019 why didn't they start another

468
00:23:25,090 --> 00:23:21,769
investigation that non-prosecution

469
00:23:28,330 --> 00:23:25,100
agreement was clear any other state

470
00:23:30,669 --> 00:23:28,340
could have begun the same investigation

471
00:23:33,940 --> 00:23:30,679
then the Southern District began a year

472
00:23:36,099 --> 00:23:33,950
ago before his arrest July 6 so why

473
00:23:41,979 --> 00:23:36,109
didn't they do that back in 2010 because

474
00:23:45,820 --> 00:23:41,989
the rate of recidivism is very high in

475
00:23:49,180 --> 00:23:45,830
pedophiles as you know and it grows

476
00:23:54,129 --> 00:23:49,190
exponentially as the years pass so the

477
00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:54,139
fact that Epstein was continuing to be

478
00:23:57,519 --> 00:23:56,090
photographed with very young girls

479
00:23:59,529 --> 00:23:57,529
should have alerted the authorities

480
00:24:01,570 --> 00:23:59,539
certainly in Palm Beach and most

481
00:24:03,549 --> 00:24:01,580
certainly in New York yes so much

482
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:03,559
registering as a sex offender I mean at

483
00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:04,850
the end of the day what does that really

484
00:24:09,940 --> 00:24:07,129
accomplish right obviously not in his

485
00:24:13,479 --> 00:24:09,950
case nothing if his name was Joe Smith

486
00:24:15,220 --> 00:24:13,489
and he was worth $50,000 or had a job

487
00:24:17,499 --> 00:24:15,230
that paid him a hundred and fifty

488
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:17,509
thousand dollars he would be in jail

489
00:24:21,779 --> 00:24:20,690
you know but but clearly and sadly and I

490
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:21,789
really mean this

491
00:24:27,670 --> 00:24:25,730
sadly there is evidently two systems of

492
00:24:30,370 --> 00:24:27,680
justice in our country one for the rich

493
00:24:33,010 --> 00:24:30,380
one for the poor and that is sad because

494
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:33,020
in cases like Epstein it doesn't help

495
00:24:40,450 --> 00:24:37,970
victims it actually places many children

496
00:24:42,580 --> 00:24:40,460
at a great disadvantage what do you

497
00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:42,590
think of the case that Katie Johnson I

498
00:24:48,070 --> 00:24:45,170
think that's a made-up name for the case

499
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:48,080
where she alleged that Trump had raped

500
00:24:52,770 --> 00:24:50,570
her and then that case was dismissed not

501
00:24:55,450 --> 00:24:52,780
many people are talking about that case

502
00:24:57,820 --> 00:24:55,460
exactly well I investigated that case

503
00:25:01,060 --> 00:24:57,830
pretty thoroughly I number one I think

504
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:01,070
she is not telling the truth number two

505
00:25:10,180 --> 00:25:05,690
I think the case was filed April 18th I

506
00:25:12,970 --> 00:25:10,190
believe or April 16th forgive me 2016 in

507
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:12,980
Lancaster California and it was

508
00:25:18,580 --> 00:25:15,010
dismissed on a technicality

509
00:25:21,460 --> 00:25:18,590
and then it was refiled by an attorney

510
00:25:23,410 --> 00:25:21,470
she hired Thomas meager a patent

511
00:25:26,530 --> 00:25:23,420
attorney in Princeton New Jersey and it

512
00:25:31,660 --> 00:25:26,540
was filed in September 16th and it was

513
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:31,670
dismissed November 4th of 2016 and it

514
00:25:38,860 --> 00:25:34,850
was dismissed voluntarily meaning she

515
00:25:43,540 --> 00:25:38,870
asked to dismiss the case I believe that

516
00:25:45,130 --> 00:25:43,550
her allegations were just look I am

517
00:25:47,820 --> 00:25:45,140
always on the side of victims

518
00:25:51,910 --> 00:25:47,830
I tend and want to believe victims

519
00:25:54,430 --> 00:25:51,920
rather than defendants but in her

520
00:25:57,190 --> 00:25:54,440
particular case I it was too

521
00:26:01,750 --> 00:25:57,200
extraordinary just that the the way she

522
00:26:04,810 --> 00:26:01,760
phrased the way she she accused them

523
00:26:08,380 --> 00:26:04,820
both men and and the way she talked

524
00:26:10,990 --> 00:26:08,390
about what President Trump and Epstein

525
00:26:14,590 --> 00:26:11,000
together not independently of each other

526
00:26:17,170 --> 00:26:14,600
but together did to her didn't make any

527
00:26:19,980 --> 00:26:17,180
sense and it was not compatible with

528
00:26:22,860 --> 00:26:19,990
either mr. Epstein's history or

529
00:26:25,300 --> 00:26:22,870
president Trump's history so I I

530
00:26:27,940 --> 00:26:25,310
dismissed that case when I spoke to the

531
00:26:29,590 --> 00:26:27,950
lawyer for the victims Brad Edwards and

532
00:26:32,590 --> 00:26:29,600
I said Brad do you want to take on this

533
00:26:34,780 --> 00:26:32,600
case because this the moment I heard

534
00:26:38,020 --> 00:26:34,790
about the case in April I I was just

535
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:38,030
about to publish my book and so it came

536
00:26:42,340 --> 00:26:39,530
to my attention and I

537
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:42,350
we called Brad Edwards and he wouldn't

538
00:26:47,530 --> 00:26:44,210
take the case and the fact that Brad

539
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:47,540
Edwards would not take the case to me

540
00:26:54,010 --> 00:26:51,650
was the biggest red flag because he had

541
00:26:58,660 --> 00:26:54,020
been you know he had been a lead lawyer

542
00:27:00,340 --> 00:26:58,670
for these defendants and speaking of

543
00:27:02,620 --> 00:27:00,350
Brad Edwards what do you know about his

544
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:02,630
law partner Scott Rothstein are you

545
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:04,850
familiar with that name yes I am very

546
00:27:10,090 --> 00:27:07,490
much familiar with that well Scott

547
00:27:13,360 --> 00:27:10,100
Rothstein even though I didn't interview

548
00:27:16,690 --> 00:27:13,370
him or meet him I know Brad but I didn't

549
00:27:19,510 --> 00:27:16,700
I never met Rothstein I know he was a

550
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:19,520
sort of you know a swindler of sorts in

551
00:27:26,830 --> 00:27:24,410
South Florida and he created a Ponzi

552
00:27:30,970 --> 00:27:26,840
scheme and used Brad Edwards I believe

553
00:27:33,340 --> 00:27:30,980
that he truly used Brad to profit and to

554
00:27:36,370 --> 00:27:33,350
benefit from the Epstein case that Brad

555
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:36,380
brought to him because prior to their

556
00:27:41,500 --> 00:27:39,170
association Brad was a solo attorney and

557
00:27:45,010 --> 00:27:41,510
realized that the Epstein case was just

558
00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:45,020
such a big case that he needed a firm a

559
00:27:50,290 --> 00:27:48,110
large firm to sustain the case and so he

560
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:50,300
partnered with with Rothstein but

561
00:27:56,860 --> 00:27:52,850
Rothstein was obviously evidently he's

562
00:28:00,220 --> 00:27:56,870
in jail you know he wasn't a very honest

563
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:00,230
man and and so it derailed and Epstein

564
00:28:08,350 --> 00:28:04,490
used their partnership to basically

565
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:08,360
point fingers and and manipulate the the

566
00:28:14,260 --> 00:28:11,810
case as if Grad was the one that was the

567
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:14,270
you know the culprit here and and the

568
00:28:19,420 --> 00:28:16,250
swindler and in fact it was not Brad

569
00:28:20,890 --> 00:28:19,430
Edwards it was rusty Wow that sounds

570
00:28:27,660 --> 00:28:20,900
like its own movie right there

571
00:28:30,730 --> 00:28:27,670
oh yeah this is gonna be a multi-year

572
00:28:32,580 --> 00:28:30,740
miniseries so Ross isn't right that

573
00:28:36,070 --> 00:28:32,590
Rothstein was accused of sex trafficking

574
00:28:38,530 --> 00:28:36,080
uh no I did not hear that at all i I'm

575
00:28:40,660 --> 00:28:38,540
not familiar with that allegation owned

576
00:28:43,570 --> 00:28:40,670
only a Ponzi scheme that he's now in

577
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:43,580
jail for yes but it was money what he

578
00:28:52,870 --> 00:28:48,250
would do is he would solicit investors

579
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:52,880
to invest in his clients meaning

580
00:28:58,420 --> 00:28:56,690
in his legal cases and it ace of Epstein

581
00:29:00,430 --> 00:28:58,430
what he did was he told different

582
00:29:04,290 --> 00:29:00,440
investors listen this case is a done

583
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:04,300
deal it's wrapped up we need a whatever

584
00:29:10,330 --> 00:29:07,250
$50,000 I'm just throwing a figure I

585
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:10,340
don't remember the figure exactly but he

586
00:29:15,250 --> 00:29:13,490
he requested an investment from his

587
00:29:17,230 --> 00:29:15,260
clients and they would give him that

588
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:17,240
investment and then he would basically

589
00:29:23,190 --> 00:29:21,290
draw on that money and give the clients

590
00:29:25,870 --> 00:29:23,200
and interest the investors an interest

591
00:29:28,750 --> 00:29:25,880
in the firm and of course it was all a

592
00:29:32,770 --> 00:29:28,760
Ponzi scheme to to make money I mean he

593
00:29:34,270 --> 00:29:32,780
was truly extraordinary what would he he

594
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:34,280
created and ultimately has some

595
00:29:38,890 --> 00:29:37,010
connection Epstein you believe well no

596
00:29:40,510 --> 00:29:38,900
he didn't have because Rothstein didn't

597
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:40,520
have a connection with Epstein it was

598
00:29:44,130 --> 00:29:42,410
Brad Edwards who was handling the

599
00:29:47,530 --> 00:29:44,140
Epstein case he was defending victims

600
00:29:50,020 --> 00:29:47,540
but he brought the Epstein case to

601
00:29:51,940 --> 00:29:50,030
Rothstein because he needed a firm in

602
00:29:54,070 --> 00:29:51,950
Rothstein had a pretty substantial at

603
00:29:56,860 --> 00:29:54,080
that time firm in Fort Lauderdale

604
00:29:59,710 --> 00:29:56,870
Florida mm-hmm okay last question for

605
00:30:03,420 --> 00:29:59,720
you is it involves an Epstein bodyguard

606
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:03,430
I believe bodyguard that died in prison

607
00:30:10,030 --> 00:30:06,650
it was his house manager Alfredo

608
00:30:11,980 --> 00:30:10,040
Rodriguez okay this man who I met many

609
00:30:15,580 --> 00:30:11,990
times and spoke to him and his wife

610
00:30:21,820 --> 00:30:15,590
Patricia done quite sad very sad story

611
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:21,830
so his house manager was he seemed to me

612
00:30:28,540 --> 00:30:25,610
a very upright moral moral man in the

613
00:30:30,970 --> 00:30:28,550
sense that he did not like what he saw

614
00:30:33,370 --> 00:30:30,980
in terms of the little girls coming in

615
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:33,380
and out of the house and he told his

616
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:36,170
wife and there was a cook I believe her

617
00:30:41,740 --> 00:30:38,570
name was Betty she was one of Epstein's

618
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:41,750
cooks in his Palm Beach House and both

619
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:45,050
of them together were quite upset at the

620
00:30:52,750 --> 00:30:48,890
debauchery going on and he had to clean

621
00:30:56,230 --> 00:30:52,760
up the sex toys used by Epstein with the

622
00:30:59,860 --> 00:30:56,240
girls and so one day he saw a car

623
00:31:02,230 --> 00:30:59,870
sitting it was dusk and he saw a car

624
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:02,240
sitting outside of the house and he took

625
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:04,370
the opportunity to call the police and

626
00:31:07,700 --> 00:31:05,610
told the police

627
00:31:09,770 --> 00:31:07,710
that there was a strange car sitting

628
00:31:12,380 --> 00:31:09,780
outside of mr. Epstein's house and of

629
00:31:14,390 --> 00:31:12,390
course that strange car belonged to one

630
00:31:16,220 --> 00:31:14,400
of the girls and so the police

631
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:16,230
questioned the girls nothing happened

632
00:31:21,410 --> 00:31:17,730
because at that time there was no

633
00:31:25,070 --> 00:31:21,420
investigation but epstein obviously was

634
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:25,080
alerted and was concerned and used that

635
00:31:30,980 --> 00:31:28,290
incident to fire Rodriguez he then

636
00:31:34,130 --> 00:31:30,990
accused Rodriguez of stealing from him

637
00:31:37,789 --> 00:31:34,140
and so then Rodriguez takes a deposition

638
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:37,799
and because Epstein obviously at that

639
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:42,210
time was not under investigation he told

640
00:31:46,159 --> 00:31:44,010
a lot of the Palm Beach residents about

641
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:46,169
Rodriguez and what a thief he was and so

642
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:47,730
Rodriguez couldn't get a job and

643
00:31:52,039 --> 00:31:50,130
Rodriguez had always been a butler and a

644
00:31:56,169 --> 00:31:52,049
house manager and so he couldn't find

645
00:31:58,180 --> 00:31:56,179
other work in Palm Beach so he actually

646
00:32:01,460 --> 00:31:58,190
got involved with the wrong people

647
00:32:03,799 --> 00:32:01,470
cousins of his or family close to family

648
00:32:06,380 --> 00:32:03,809
members and the family members were

649
00:32:08,539 --> 00:32:06,390
transporting weapons and they put a

650
00:32:12,409 --> 00:32:08,549
number of weapons in the trunk of his

651
00:32:14,330 --> 00:32:12,419
car and when he got to his house the

652
00:32:16,310 --> 00:32:14,340
police stopped him him because he was

653
00:32:19,070 --> 00:32:16,320
driving the vehicle they arrested him

654
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:19,080
but this was after he was deposed

655
00:32:24,950 --> 00:32:21,650
because of the Epstein case and after

656
00:32:26,900 --> 00:32:24,960
Rodriguez tried to sell what he called

657
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:26,910
the little black book which was the

658
00:32:33,169 --> 00:32:29,490
directory of addresses and information

659
00:32:36,350 --> 00:32:33,179
on on that Epstein held but the weird

660
00:32:39,890 --> 00:32:36,360
thing is because the detective who

661
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:39,900
actually arrested Rodriguez was friendly

662
00:32:45,409 --> 00:32:41,970
with me at the time and said to me you

663
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:45,419
know the Department of Justice is

664
00:32:51,980 --> 00:32:48,690
accusing and blaming Rodriguez for

665
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:51,990
selling a little black book the the

666
00:32:58,220 --> 00:32:55,650
directory for $50,000 and for

667
00:33:00,770 --> 00:32:58,230
withholding information when according

668
00:33:02,780 --> 00:33:00,780
to this private investigator he said the

669
00:33:04,340 --> 00:33:02,790
Department of Justice already had the

670
00:33:06,590 --> 00:33:04,350
information of the black book in fact

671
00:33:09,799 --> 00:33:06,600
when they raided the house they found

672
00:33:13,250 --> 00:33:09,809
multiple quote black books because the

673
00:33:14,900 --> 00:33:13,260
black book was really just a sheet there

674
00:33:17,510 --> 00:33:14,910
were multiple sheets of computerized

675
00:33:18,050 --> 00:33:17,520
names and addresses stapled together it

676
00:33:20,420 --> 00:33:18,060
wasn't

677
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:20,430
really a black book it was just a you

678
00:33:26,570 --> 00:33:22,770
know a hundred sheets of paper with

679
00:33:28,940 --> 00:33:26,580
names and addresses of people he knew so

680
00:33:30,980 --> 00:33:28,950
it was pretty odd right that they would

681
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:30,990
that the Department of Justice that you

682
00:33:38,390 --> 00:33:34,970
Sao would accuse this poor man of

683
00:33:41,060 --> 00:33:38,400
obstructing justice and not giving them

684
00:33:43,850 --> 00:33:41,070
the little black book and trying to sell

685
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:43,860
it for $50,000 when in fact they already

686
00:33:48,770 --> 00:33:46,770
had that information and so that's what

687
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:48,780
he went to jail for was obstruction of

688
00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:49,170
justice

689
00:33:53,330 --> 00:33:50,850
but what about the weapons in the trunk

690
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:53,340
that had nothing to do this that was the

691
00:33:59,510 --> 00:33:56,370
second charge so he to J well he was a

692
00:34:01,910 --> 00:33:59,520
he was he was indicted on the first

693
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:01,920
charge but he was I believe he was given

694
00:34:07,220 --> 00:34:04,890
a he was given some sort of you know he

695
00:34:09,740 --> 00:34:07,230
was he wasn't given jail time he was

696
00:34:11,420 --> 00:34:09,750
given community service and then when

697
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:11,430
they caught him with the weapons with

698
00:34:17,090 --> 00:34:14,610
the guns in his trunk then they arrested

699
00:34:19,700 --> 00:34:17,100
him is that enough scene is that enough

700
00:34:22,550 --> 00:34:19,710
scene set up weapons in the truck

701
00:34:24,470 --> 00:34:22,560
no III think he really was desperate for

702
00:34:26,630 --> 00:34:24,480
work you know he had a wife and he had

703
00:34:29,390 --> 00:34:26,640
children and he'd was desperate to get

704
00:34:32,420 --> 00:34:29,400
work and you know he just fell in the

705
00:34:36,020 --> 00:34:32,430
wrong hands with the wrong people and

706
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:36,030
but you know this man was truly a victim

707
00:34:41,540 --> 00:34:39,210
I mean truly a victim of and if you're

708
00:34:43,370 --> 00:34:41,550
suspicious of Epstein's death in prison

709
00:34:46,250 --> 00:34:43,380
shouldn't you be even more suspicious of

710
00:34:48,950 --> 00:34:46,260
Rodriguez's death in prison well he did

711
00:34:50,420 --> 00:34:48,960
he died of cancer he was actually I knew

712
00:34:52,010 --> 00:34:50,430
because I was talking to him at the time

713
00:34:53,030 --> 00:34:52,020
and I was talking to his wife Patricia

714
00:34:56,720 --> 00:34:53,040
Dunn

715
00:34:59,540 --> 00:34:56,730
he died not in jail he died right after

716
00:35:03,680 --> 00:34:59,550
he was released from prison in Florida

717
00:35:06,470 --> 00:35:03,690
and he was diagnosed with a very serious

718
00:35:07,060 --> 00:35:06,480
form of cancer and he died pretty much

719
00:35:09,710 --> 00:35:07,070
right away

720
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:09,720
fascinating well thanks for setting the

721
00:35:13,850 --> 00:35:11,130
record straight on that and just about

722
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:13,860
everything else you are the true Jeffrey

723
00:35:23,330 --> 00:35:21,330
Epstein expert like it or not well

724
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:23,340
hopefully we're helping to expose and

725
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:25,050
not what he just what they did but what

726
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:27,290
what as you point out is going on

727
00:35:31,130 --> 00:35:29,370
extensively around the world

728
00:35:32,540 --> 00:35:31,140
Epstein's shutting a light on it that

729
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:32,550
I'm sure you hope is going to shut a

730
00:35:36,950 --> 00:35:34,650
light on a lot of other things yes I do

731
00:35:38,900 --> 00:35:36,960
and Jim thank you for being a light

732
00:35:42,650 --> 00:35:38,910
because you know it is your light that

733
00:35:44,690 --> 00:35:42,660
is going to help not me selfishly create

734
00:35:47,780 --> 00:35:44,700
the human trafficking Research Center at

735
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:47,790
Georgetown University that is my goal in

736
00:35:52,820 --> 00:35:50,490
life to create that Center and open it

737
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:52,830
so students can learn about human

738
00:35:57,620 --> 00:35:55,170
trafficking and we can help Congress

739
00:36:00,020 --> 00:35:57,630
create the right laws but also to open

740
00:36:03,980 --> 00:36:00,030
safe houses across the world and you are

741
00:36:06,230 --> 00:36:03,990
a light in that in that story and thank

742
00:36:07,730 --> 00:36:06,240
you so much thank you Conchita and in

743
00:36:09,650 --> 00:36:07,740
fact I I know that you referenced

744
00:36:11,270 --> 00:36:09,660
there's already been a law passed under

745
00:36:12,890 --> 00:36:11,280
the Trump administration that resulted

746
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:12,900
in in backpage.com getting shut down

747
00:36:18,110 --> 00:36:16,290
right yes and I was I did a lot of work

748
00:36:20,060 --> 00:36:18,120
on that and now we're working I'm

749
00:36:22,670 --> 00:36:20,070
working with Congress I've already

750
00:36:25,700 --> 00:36:22,680
written to several senators to help pass

751
00:36:28,610 --> 00:36:25,710
a new law that regulates modeling agency

752
00:36:31,190 --> 00:36:28,620
so we can bring down modeling agencies

753
00:36:33,140 --> 00:36:31,200
like M c-squared and owners like Jean

754
00:36:35,270 --> 00:36:33,150
Luc Brunel and stopped them from

755
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:35,280
trafficking our children so that's the

756
00:36:40,850 --> 00:36:37,770
next legislative legislation I'm working

757
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:40,860
on now thank you to Conchita Sarnoff one

758
00:36:46,190 --> 00:36:44,010
post note she noted that attorney Barr

759
00:36:48,650 --> 00:36:46,200
told her that he would pursue this case

760
00:36:50,810 --> 00:36:48,660
even if he had to recuse himself I

761
00:36:52,550 --> 00:36:50,820
looked into that after we spoke and what

762
00:36:54,980 --> 00:36:52,560
she's referring to is the fact that Barr

763
00:36:57,110 --> 00:36:54,990
was part of the same law firm Kirkland

764
00:36:59,690 --> 00:36:57,120
and Ellis that some of the attorneys

765
00:37:01,520 --> 00:36:59,700
including Ken Starr were part of when

766
00:37:02,390 --> 00:37:01,530
they helped negotiate that plea deal for

767
00:37:04,730 --> 00:37:02,400
Epstein

768
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:04,740
so Barr was indicating that he might

769
00:37:08,620 --> 00:37:06,210
have to recuse himself from any

770
00:37:11,390 --> 00:37:08,630
prosecution so far Barr has not and

771
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:11,400
apparently is going after Epstein but

772
00:37:16,550 --> 00:37:13,290
that is yet to be determined exactly how

773
00:37:18,740 --> 00:37:16,560
far this investigation will go we will

774
00:37:21,260 --> 00:37:18,750
continue following the Epstein matter

775
00:37:23,090 --> 00:37:21,270
with our future episodes also regarding

776
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:23,100
Conchita Sarnoff if you would like to

777
00:37:29,390 --> 00:37:26,490
support her cause you can go to her

778
00:37:31,610 --> 00:37:29,400
website at Conchita Sarnoff dot-com

779
00:37:34,370 --> 00:37:31,620
thats Conchita Sarnoff com we'll put

780
00:37:35,810 --> 00:37:34,380
that up on our website and on Facebook

781
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:35,820
thank you to our producer Michael Parker

782
00:37:39,290 --> 00:37:37,530
we'll be back next week with another

783
00:37:44,289 --> 00:37:39,300
episode of the hidden tree show

784
00:37:48,829 --> 00:37:46,220
thank you for listening at the hidden

785
00:37:52,220 --> 00:37:48,839
trade show with Jim Breslow you can find

786
00:37:55,190 --> 00:37:52,230
us at hidden truths show.com follow us

787
00:37:57,470 --> 00:37:55,200
on Facebook Twitter and Instagram and he

788
00:37:59,960 --> 00:37:57,480
in the truth show join us again next

789
00:38:03,090 --> 00:37:59,970
week for another episode of hitman trade